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	<title>Comments on: The Manifesto for the Ascendancy of the Modern American N*gger</title>
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	<link>http://blacksmythe.com/blog/2006/11/30/the-manifesto-for-the-ascendancy-of-the-modern-american-ngger/</link>
	<description>Intellectual discussions on pressing issues</description>
	<pubDate>Fri, 05 Dec 2008 17:02:20 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Lester Spence</title>
		<link>http://blacksmythe.com/blog/2006/11/30/the-manifesto-for-the-ascendancy-of-the-modern-american-ngger/#comment-409</link>
		<dc:creator>Lester Spence</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Dec 2006 13:16:04 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>i had a proposal all ready to go, about to dip my feet into the pond scum.  then i remembered i had bigger fish to fry. 

there is something about this particular moment that brings the ridleys and mcwhorters out into the woodwork that bears study and witness.  but ridley?  yeah...pimp is as accurate a term as any.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>i had a proposal all ready to go, about to dip my feet into the pond scum.  then i remembered i had bigger fish to fry. </p>
<p>there is something about this particular moment that brings the ridleys and mcwhorters out into the woodwork that bears study and witness.  but ridley?  yeah&#8230;pimp is as accurate a term as any.</p>
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		<title>By: Cobb</title>
		<link>http://blacksmythe.com/blog/2006/11/30/the-manifesto-for-the-ascendancy-of-the-modern-american-ngger/#comment-407</link>
		<dc:creator>Cobb</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Dec 2006 04:50:09 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>So we are met on a great battlefied of the moment testing whether people should long note this manifesto. Whether this controversial vocabulary will imbue a new generation with the passion to recognize geopolitics. The answer is hell no. John Ridley may have written the best political hiphop song of the decade. Unfortunately he thinks he was doing something more serious than that. Serious people don't listen to political hiphop, except for the beats. Ridley's direction is correct but his rhythm blows chunks. There is nothing to be gained but the emnity and scorn of right thinking people when you call your political enemies niggers. The editors of Esquire and Huffington may dig them bongos, thinking they've found the next beat poet for black conservatives, but this black conservative ain't buying it. Sorry but I'll never march to that drum. I don't care who's beating it. I know that the path to righteousness is not paved with the bodies of rhetorical niggers. We still have people with good judgment. I'm trying to imagine this man trying to slap five with Dr. Rice. I'm sure she, like I, would leave him hanging.

John Ridley will get to represent, and we probably won't be rid of him for a good while. The pimps over at Esquire and Huffington will get him to shake his ass over a few more solemn subjects, and who knows, he may become as influential as Sista Soljah or maybe even Eldridge Cleaver. Yay for free speech. Yay for America.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So we are met on a great battlefied of the moment testing whether people should long note this manifesto. Whether this controversial vocabulary will imbue a new generation with the passion to recognize geopolitics. The answer is hell no. John Ridley may have written the best political hiphop song of the decade. Unfortunately he thinks he was doing something more serious than that. Serious people don&#8217;t listen to political hiphop, except for the beats. Ridley&#8217;s direction is correct but his rhythm blows chunks. There is nothing to be gained but the emnity and scorn of right thinking people when you call your political enemies niggers. The editors of Esquire and Huffington may dig them bongos, thinking they&#8217;ve found the next beat poet for black conservatives, but this black conservative ain&#8217;t buying it. Sorry but I&#8217;ll never march to that drum. I don&#8217;t care who&#8217;s beating it. I know that the path to righteousness is not paved with the bodies of rhetorical niggers. We still have people with good judgment. I&#8217;m trying to imagine this man trying to slap five with Dr. Rice. I&#8217;m sure she, like I, would leave him hanging.</p>
<p>John Ridley will get to represent, and we probably won&#8217;t be rid of him for a good while. The pimps over at Esquire and Huffington will get him to shake his ass over a few more solemn subjects, and who knows, he may become as influential as Sista Soljah or maybe even Eldridge Cleaver. Yay for free speech. Yay for America.</p>
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		<title>By: E.C. Hopkins</title>
		<link>http://blacksmythe.com/blog/2006/11/30/the-manifesto-for-the-ascendancy-of-the-modern-american-ngger/#comment-289</link>
		<dc:creator>E.C. Hopkins</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 01 Dec 2006 18:34:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blacksmythe.com/blog/2006/11/30/the-manifesto-for-the-ascendancy-of-the-modern-american-ngger/#comment-289</guid>
		<description>CLR Odell:

Black America's intellectuals have been at war for more than a century. This war preceded and, I think, begat the Black American Renaissance and the U.S. Civil Rights Movement. Its modern combatants and battles, however, are markedly different in this new 21st Century. Its modern philosophical and ideological battles involve thinkers, speakers, and writers who are quite heedless and believe they, as individuals, would have little to lose and their fellow Black Americans (and non-Black American world citizens) stand only to gain, if they were to submit their often bootless thesesâ€”theses that fail to penetrate, fail to synthesize, and fail to inventâ€”as rhetorical pleas aiming to motivate or persuade Blacks (and non-Blacks). Aiming, in their minds, to do more than just badly rephrase thoughts that were published by wiser, more operose, and more altruistic Black thinkers, writers, orators, and leaders in the 19th Century and early 20th Century. Aiming, to save Black America from herself or other forces that wish her harm or wish her no good.

These are noble aims. However, most of those who are sharing their ideas believe they have tongues of silver and pens of gold, when in fact, they have not prepared well enough to evoke responsible speechâ€”they have not readied themselves to become vehicles for novel ideas and real solutions. They have not developed the linguistic and rhetorical competences that would enable them to be both effective esoteric and empathetic exoteric communicators. Nevertheless, the roses have been drawn: Cultural vs. Structural. And, the combatants and the battlefields abound. 

I would like to dialogue with or use what I know of the art of rhetoric in order to compete against, thinkers, writers, and speakers such as John Ridley. If his â€œManifesto of Ascendancy for the Modern American Niggerâ€ reveals his true opinions, then his rhetoric and arguments would mostly compete against mine. However, unless or until I win a seat with a proper elite law school and gain a fitting horn through which to blow my ideas upon graduating from it with honors, Iâ€™ll remain a municipal entrepreneur, a community servant, and a casual and occasional blogger, who would not and should not be viewed by many as a combatant of consequence in this Black Civil War of Ideas. An important war, I think.

If I do win a seat with the right law school, Iâ€™ll try to shake a radiant spear and strike my first major blow in a few years. So, though I now sit back in a somewhat disappointed state, reading and listening to the sciolistic, heedless, and selfish words of so many Black thinkers and Black â€œleaders,â€ feeling impelled to strike a blow myself, this quarrel will have to drink blood another day.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>CLR Odell:</p>
<p>Black America&#8217;s intellectuals have been at war for more than a century. This war preceded and, I think, begat the Black American Renaissance and the U.S. Civil Rights Movement. Its modern combatants and battles, however, are markedly different in this new 21st Century. Its modern philosophical and ideological battles involve thinkers, speakers, and writers who are quite heedless and believe they, as individuals, would have little to lose and their fellow Black Americans (and non-Black American world citizens) stand only to gain, if they were to submit their often bootless thesesâ€”theses that fail to penetrate, fail to synthesize, and fail to inventâ€”as rhetorical pleas aiming to motivate or persuade Blacks (and non-Blacks). Aiming, in their minds, to do more than just badly rephrase thoughts that were published by wiser, more operose, and more altruistic Black thinkers, writers, orators, and leaders in the 19th Century and early 20th Century. Aiming, to save Black America from herself or other forces that wish her harm or wish her no good.</p>
<p>These are noble aims. However, most of those who are sharing their ideas believe they have tongues of silver and pens of gold, when in fact, they have not prepared well enough to evoke responsible speechâ€”they have not readied themselves to become vehicles for novel ideas and real solutions. They have not developed the linguistic and rhetorical competences that would enable them to be both effective esoteric and empathetic exoteric communicators. Nevertheless, the roses have been drawn: Cultural vs. Structural. And, the combatants and the battlefields abound. </p>
<p>I would like to dialogue with or use what I know of the art of rhetoric in order to compete against, thinkers, writers, and speakers such as John Ridley. If his â€œManifesto of Ascendancy for the Modern American Niggerâ€ reveals his true opinions, then his rhetoric and arguments would mostly compete against mine. However, unless or until I win a seat with a proper elite law school and gain a fitting horn through which to blow my ideas upon graduating from it with honors, Iâ€™ll remain a municipal entrepreneur, a community servant, and a casual and occasional blogger, who would not and should not be viewed by many as a combatant of consequence in this Black Civil War of Ideas. An important war, I think.</p>
<p>If I do win a seat with the right law school, Iâ€™ll try to shake a radiant spear and strike my first major blow in a few years. So, though I now sit back in a somewhat disappointed state, reading and listening to the sciolistic, heedless, and selfish words of so many Black thinkers and Black â€œleaders,â€ feeling impelled to strike a blow myself, this quarrel will have to drink blood another day.</p>
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		<title>By: CLR Odell</title>
		<link>http://blacksmythe.com/blog/2006/11/30/the-manifesto-for-the-ascendancy-of-the-modern-american-ngger/#comment-277</link>
		<dc:creator>CLR Odell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 01 Dec 2006 06:28:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blacksmythe.com/blog/2006/11/30/the-manifesto-for-the-ascendancy-of-the-modern-american-ngger/#comment-277</guid>
		<description>nevermind doc, I actually just took the time to re-read your comment and I think:

"Thereâ€™s a meme thatâ€™s been going around black communities at least as long as black people have been organizing against white supremacy, blaming black failure on self-hatred. If we were to just â€œunify.â€ If we were able to somehow figure out how to get over â€œwillie lynchism.â€ And inevitably, someone gets around to talking about people who do it right"

just about covers it for me sorry bout the long post next time I won't be so impatient.

peace,
clr</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>nevermind doc, I actually just took the time to re-read your comment and I think:</p>
<p>&#8220;Thereâ€™s a meme thatâ€™s been going around black communities at least as long as black people have been organizing against white supremacy, blaming black failure on self-hatred. If we were to just â€œunify.â€ If we were able to somehow figure out how to get over â€œwillie lynchism.â€ And inevitably, someone gets around to talking about people who do it right&#8221;</p>
<p>just about covers it for me sorry bout the long post next time I won&#8217;t be so impatient.</p>
<p>peace,<br />
clr</p>
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		<title>By: CLR Odell</title>
		<link>http://blacksmythe.com/blog/2006/11/30/the-manifesto-for-the-ascendancy-of-the-modern-american-ngger/#comment-275</link>
		<dc:creator>CLR Odell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 30 Nov 2006 20:49:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blacksmythe.com/blog/2006/11/30/the-manifesto-for-the-ascendancy-of-the-modern-american-ngger/#comment-275</guid>
		<description>Hey Doc,

Couldn't agree more this piece is of little value other than shock.  It's filled with methodoglogical flaws and heaps of historical revisionism.

For example, the historically dubious statement:
"Now, let me tell you something about my generation of black Americans. We are the inheritors of "the Deal" forced upon the entrenched white social, political, and legal establishment when my parents' generation won the struggle for civil rights. The Deal: We (blacks) take what is rightfully ours and you (the afore-described establishment) get citizens who will invest the same energy and dedication into raising families and working hard and being all around good people as was invested in snapping the neck of Jim Crow."

I got it so MLK et al. bartered a deal with the white establishment basically saying that they would keep the unruly blacks in check in return for a "seat at the table" as it were.  Talented tenth rubbish.

Obviously Huey and Bobby weren't at that meeting where "The Deal" was brokered 

"If we as a race could win the centuries-long war against institutionalized racism, why is it that so many of us cannot secure the advantage after decades of freedom?" 

I wasn't aware that the war was over and if black folks won the war then somebody ain't stickin' to the peace treaty, see Florida 2000, New Orleans 2005 etc., etc., etc. 

On a more important note, I'd like to know what you think about this whole line of argument.  Is this something that in your opinion has existed for awhile, i.e. is it some form of mutated Garveyism or DuBoisian talented tenth stuff.  

Or is this elite black shame(? I don't think I like that characterization but I can't think of anything else) a new phenomenon that could be seen as a logical consequence of the civil rights movement.  Not in the way Ridley characterizes it but more in the way Nelson Peery (don't know if you're familiar, he's with The League of Revolutionaries for a New America based out of Chicago) does, saying that the civil rights movement took the pressure off blacks as a nation and the different class elements were able to gravitate to their natural resting places.  I'm butchering his analysis but it can be found in his book The Future Is Up To Us.

I happen to think that both are a little top down in their methodology and both ignore the reasons for why young poor folks of any color act the way they do.  These kids are without any visible signs of a future and so Tupac's "Me Against the World" thug life anthems become not a vision for the future but a romantic
way of dealing with presently oppressive and depressing conditions.

It seems that when we get caught up in telling people what they SHOULD be doing instead of asking ourselves why they ARE doing what they're doing and doing away with the morality that so often clouds any kind of scientific thought. 

Anyway this was a long-winded and hastily thrown together comment that will maybe come off more disjointed than the original comment itself, it just seems like this kind of thinking is on the rise but I've only been paying attention for a few years now, and I thought you, or Mr. Hopkins perhaps?, might have something to say.

peace,
clr</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey Doc,</p>
<p>Couldn&#8217;t agree more this piece is of little value other than shock.  It&#8217;s filled with methodoglogical flaws and heaps of historical revisionism.</p>
<p>For example, the historically dubious statement:<br />
&#8220;Now, let me tell you something about my generation of black Americans. We are the inheritors of &#8220;the Deal&#8221; forced upon the entrenched white social, political, and legal establishment when my parents&#8217; generation won the struggle for civil rights. The Deal: We (blacks) take what is rightfully ours and you (the afore-described establishment) get citizens who will invest the same energy and dedication into raising families and working hard and being all around good people as was invested in snapping the neck of Jim Crow.&#8221;</p>
<p>I got it so MLK et al. bartered a deal with the white establishment basically saying that they would keep the unruly blacks in check in return for a &#8220;seat at the table&#8221; as it were.  Talented tenth rubbish.</p>
<p>Obviously Huey and Bobby weren&#8217;t at that meeting where &#8220;The Deal&#8221; was brokered </p>
<p>&#8220;If we as a race could win the centuries-long war against institutionalized racism, why is it that so many of us cannot secure the advantage after decades of freedom?&#8221; </p>
<p>I wasn&#8217;t aware that the war was over and if black folks won the war then somebody ain&#8217;t stickin&#8217; to the peace treaty, see Florida 2000, New Orleans 2005 etc., etc., etc. </p>
<p>On a more important note, I&#8217;d like to know what you think about this whole line of argument.  Is this something that in your opinion has existed for awhile, i.e. is it some form of mutated Garveyism or DuBoisian talented tenth stuff.  </p>
<p>Or is this elite black shame(? I don&#8217;t think I like that characterization but I can&#8217;t think of anything else) a new phenomenon that could be seen as a logical consequence of the civil rights movement.  Not in the way Ridley characterizes it but more in the way Nelson Peery (don&#8217;t know if you&#8217;re familiar, he&#8217;s with The League of Revolutionaries for a New America based out of Chicago) does, saying that the civil rights movement took the pressure off blacks as a nation and the different class elements were able to gravitate to their natural resting places.  I&#8217;m butchering his analysis but it can be found in his book The Future Is Up To Us.</p>
<p>I happen to think that both are a little top down in their methodology and both ignore the reasons for why young poor folks of any color act the way they do.  These kids are without any visible signs of a future and so Tupac&#8217;s &#8220;Me Against the World&#8221; thug life anthems become not a vision for the future but a romantic<br />
way of dealing with presently oppressive and depressing conditions.</p>
<p>It seems that when we get caught up in telling people what they SHOULD be doing instead of asking ourselves why they ARE doing what they&#8217;re doing and doing away with the morality that so often clouds any kind of scientific thought. </p>
<p>Anyway this was a long-winded and hastily thrown together comment that will maybe come off more disjointed than the original comment itself, it just seems like this kind of thinking is on the rise but I&#8217;ve only been paying attention for a few years now, and I thought you, or Mr. Hopkins perhaps?, might have something to say.</p>
<p>peace,<br />
clr</p>
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